OK, this is to help out...
I posted a longer version before but only hit reply instead of sending it to
the whole list...oops


COMPLAINTS ETC will be most effective to the journalist who wrote an
*offending* piece, or at the most the section editor.

Emailing editor-in-chief/publisher or editor of the whole newspaper will
likely just get you ignored. Because they're not directly involved with this
stuff and also there are approximately one million fruitloops  out there
that send opinionated letters every day to newspapers... ;-)

Also, if you want to be believed, please check your spelling, grammar etc.

Must dash, but trust me on this, OK?

xx
fleur
senior journalist






> The "journo who wrote that crap" was Allan Mitchell, the AFR Economics
> Editor...
>
> <sarcasm> Because the "Economics Editor" has SUCH an insight into Road
> Safety </sarcasm>
>
> amitchell@...
>
> And
>
> AFR Editor-in-Chief/Publisher
> Michael Gill
> mgill@...
>
> EDITOR
> Glenn Burge
> gburge@...
>
> These email addresses are public domain, so I'm sure they would be
> delighted to hear the MC community's comments.
>  >:)
>
> Tim.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve [mailto:hughsysmailbox@...]
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 December 2004 1:51 PM
> To: bikers_anon@...
> Subject: [bikers_anon] Re: Newspaper calls for motorcycles to be taxed
> off the road
>
>
>
>
> The article was lifted from the Financial Review, which means alot of
> accountants read it, out of all the people you know that ride a
> motorcycle, how many of them are accountants?
>
> I wonder if every accountant in Australia with this same view were
> all together, would they out number the total number of Australian
> motorcyclists, i don't think so, in other words it doesn't matter, it
> has no weight, the more people that take up riding, the more weight
> there will be in our views as motorcyclists, do you think the
> government doesn't know this, governments will always support what's
> popular.
>
> I wonder being accountants and all that, if they noticed or bothered
> to research the price for a green slip, ie for a bike it is much more
> expensive than for a car, after all the concept of "insurance" is
> to "spread the risk" over the user group "all motorists", yes it's so
> fair hey?
>
> And if the cost of greenslips for bikes should actually fall which
> appears to be happening, then that suggests the cost (risk) to be
> spread across the user group has in fact fallen would it not?
>
> Yes! tax off the road fuel efficient, environmentally friendly, non
> congesting personal motive transport so we can all clog up the CBD
> with cheaper to run V8 4WD's because they are taxed at a lesser rate,
> what a crock, yeh as if!
>
> In fact most serious riders would pay any amount of tax to enjoy
> riding, i know i would albeit not being happy about it.
>
> Well I hve a message for the journo who wrote that crap and it's all
> bad, sorry, get used to it because it's not going to happen!
>
> Hughsy
>
>
> --- In bikers_anon@..., maxximcz@m... wrote:
> >
> > http://www.mcnews.com.au/NewsArchives/2004/dec_finreview.htm
> >
> > Nice one. Now where the hell did I put my passport? Time to go back
> > to normal world. This country is getting mad. 130km limit on
> speedos.
> > Higher tax on motorcycles. Front numberplates. What's next?
> >
> > M.
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with subject "unsubscribe"
> to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _____________________________________________________________
>
> This email (including any attachments to it) is confidential, legally
privileged, subject to copyright and is sent for the personal attention of
the intended recipient only. If you have received this email in error,
please advise us immediately and delete it. You are notified that
disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action in reliance on the
contents of this information is strictly prohibited. Although we have taken
reasonable precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this email, we
cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the viruses
in this email or attachments. We exclude any liability for the content of
this email, or for the consequences of any actions taken on the basis of the
information provided in this email or its attachments, unless that
information is subsequently confirmed in writing. If this email contains an
offer, that should be considered as an invitation to treat.
> _____________________________________________________________
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
> Message: 14
>    Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 04:32:47 -0000
>    From: "Steve" <hughsysmailbox@...>
> Subject: Re: Newspaper calls for motorcycles to be taxed off the road
>
>
> I cant claim to represent the entire M/C community, but i can and
> will send my comments to the recipients below, i can also suggest
> anyone who feels the same way could do the same, thanks for the info.
>
> Cheers Hughsy
>
>
>
> --- In bikers_anon@..., "Uidam, T (Tim)" <tu-
> nospam@r...> wrote:
> > The "journo who wrote that crap" was Allan Mitchell, the AFR
> Economics
> > Editor...
> >
> > <sarcasm> Because the "Economics Editor" has SUCH an insight into
> Road
> > Safety </sarcasm>
> >
> > amitchell@m...
> >
> > And
> >
> > AFR Editor-in-Chief/Publisher
> > Michael Gill
> > mgill@m...
> >
> > EDITOR
> > Glenn Burge
> > gburge@m...
> >
> > These email addresses are public domain, so I'm sure they would be
> > delighted to hear the MC community's comments.
> >  >:)
> >
> > Tim.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Steve [mailto:hughsysmailbox@y...]
> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 December 2004 1:51 PM
> > To: bikers_anon@...
> > Subject: [bikers_anon] Re: Newspaper calls for motorcycles to be
> taxed
> > off the road
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > The article was lifted from the Financial Review, which means alot
> of
> > accountants read it, out of all the people you know that ride a
> > motorcycle, how many of them are accountants?
> >
> > I wonder if every accountant in Australia with this same view were
> > all together, would they out number the total number of Australian
> > motorcyclists, i don't think so, in other words it doesn't matter,
> it
> > has no weight, the more people that take up riding, the more weight
> > there will be in our views as motorcyclists, do you think the
> > government doesn't know this, governments will always support
> what's
> > popular.
> >
> > I wonder being accountants and all that, if they noticed or
> bothered
> > to research the price for a green slip, ie for a bike it is much
> more
> > expensive than for a car, after all the concept of "insurance" is
> > to "spread the risk" over the user group "all motorists", yes it's
> so
> > fair hey?
> >
> > And if the cost of greenslips for bikes should actually fall which
> > appears to be happening, then that suggests the cost (risk) to be
> > spread across the user group has in fact fallen would it not?
> >
> > Yes! tax off the road fuel efficient, environmentally friendly, non
> > congesting personal motive transport so we can all clog up the CBD
> > with cheaper to run V8 4WD's because they are taxed at a lesser
> rate,
> > what a crock, yeh as if!
> >
> > In fact most serious riders would pay any amount of tax to enjoy
> > riding, i know i would albeit not being happy about it.
> >
> > Well I hve a message for the journo who wrote that crap and it's
> all
> > bad, sorry, get used to it because it's not going to happen!
> >
> > Hughsy
> >
> >
> > --- In bikers_anon@..., maxximcz@m... wrote:
> > >
> > > http://www.mcnews.com.au/NewsArchives/2004/dec_finreview.htm
> > >
> > > Nice one. Now where the hell did I put my passport? Time to go
> back
> > > to normal world. This country is getting mad. 130km limit on
> > speedos.
> > > Higher tax on motorcycles. Front numberplates. What's next?
> > >
> > > M.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with
> subject "unsubscribe"
> > to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _____________________________________________________________
> >
> > This email (including any attachments to it) is confidential,
> legally privileged, subject to copyright and is sent for the personal
> attention of the intended recipient only. If you have received this
> email in error, please advise us immediately and delete it. You are
> notified that disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action
> in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
> prohibited. Although we have taken reasonable precautions to ensure
> no viruses are present in this email, we cannot accept responsibility
> for any loss or damage arising from the viruses in this email or
> attachments. We exclude any liability for the content of this email,
> or for the consequences of any actions taken on the basis of the
> information provided in this email or its attachments, unless that
> information is subsequently confirmed in writing. If this email
> contains an offer, that should be considered as an invitation to
> treat.
> > _____________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> ________________________________________________________________________
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with subject "unsubscribe"
> to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>

We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

DOC Cambewarra/Kangaroo Valley Ride Sunday 05/12/04

Date: Sunday, December 5, 2004
Time: All Day

Come and join the Ducati Owners Club for this ride through some
of the most beautiful parts of the Southern Highlands. Meet at
Cross Roads Hotel at Casula 9-00am for a 9-30 departure. Riding
down through the Southern Highlands, Cambewarra is 9kms out of
Kangaroo Valley and has a spectacular Lookout and mountain
café for lunch.  Riding home via the Robbo Pie Shop for
afternoon tea. Contact Cary Peters 0412 049451 www.docnsw.org.au

Ride Rating  = 3 bikes

We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

Circuit Breakers Xmas Ride day

Date: Saturday, December 18, 2004
Time: All Day

Eastern Creek Xmas Ride day $129.90 PRE-PAID for BA members over
$2000.00 in givaways

Australian Financial Review
1st Dec 2004 - Pg 62

Allan Mitchell
amitchell@...

And

AFR Editor-in-Chief/Publisher
Michael Gill
mgill@...

EDITOR
Glenn Burge
gburge@...

Actual article in...
Australian Financial Review
1st Dec 2004 - Pg 62

Allan Mitchell
amitchell@...

And

AFR Editor-in-Chief/Publisher
Michael Gill
mgill@...

EDITOR
Glenn Burge
gburge@...

it wouldn't be a typo - ..............mail.Fairfax.........?
Craig Cooper
Sydney Australia
Not a good example, more like a horrible warning
mobile email - coops1958mobile@...
http://members.optusnet.com.au/coops1958/
----- Original Message -----
From: "Laef Hosking" <dangerlaef@...>
To: <bikers_anon@...>
Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 9:05 PM
Subject: [bikers_anon] Re: Tax bikes off roads - have your say to the author




But got this:

Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following
address.

<mhmitchell@...>:
No MX or A records for mial.fairfax.com.au



--- In bikers_anon@..., "Laef Hosking"
<dangerlaef@y...> wrote:
>
> Sent this:
>
> Subject: Don't be jealous, buy a bike.
>
> I apologise if I upset you by moving through traffic quicker than your
> Audi.. or where you the one in the BMW?
>
> The easy solution of course is; don't fight us, join us.
> We're quite nice when you get to know us.
>
> -Laef






To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with subject "unsubscribe"
to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...
Yahoo! Groups Links

But got this:

Sorry, we were unable to deliver your message to the following
address.

<mhmitchell@...>:
No MX or A records for mial.fairfax.com.au



--- In bikers_anon@..., "Laef Hosking"
<dangerlaef@y...> wrote:
>
> Sent this:
>
> Subject: Don't be jealous, buy a bike.
>
> I apologise if I upset you by moving through traffic quicker than your
> Audi.. or where you the one in the BMW?
>
> The easy solution of course is; don't fight us, join us.
> We're quite nice when you get to know us.
>
> -Laef

Sent this:

Subject: Don't be jealous, buy a bike.

I apologise if I upset you by moving through traffic quicker than your
Audi.. or where you the one in the BMW?

The easy solution of course is; don't fight us, join us.
We're quite nice when you get to know us.

-Laef


--- In bikers_anon@..., THE Moto Diva
<themotodiva@y...> wrote:
> Hey Everyone
> I found the email address for the author of THAT article. The guy I
got it from suggested as many people who feel they have something to
say to young Alan, should do so. Feel free to email yourself, and pass
it to others of significance ie. everyone (bombard the dumbo)
>
> Tax motorcycles off roads
>
> Author: Alan Mitchell Economics editor – mhmitchell@m...
>
>
> Date:01/12/2004
>
> Words: 766
>
> Publication: Australian Financial Review
>
> Section: News
>
> Page: 62
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
>  The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

BA Christmas Party Saturday

Date: Saturday, December 4, 2004
Time: 7:00PM EST (GMT+11:00)

Come meet Sydney's Own iron chef! Billy is famous for not only
his terrific food but also for his martial arts displays.
$30 will get you all you can eat, places are strictly limited, 7
pm start. Location: Shop 5, 59-67 Strathallen Avenue,
Northbridge

Reserve you place on this not to be missed evening contact Robyn
on ducati_lass@...

Hey Everyone
I found the email address for the author of THAT article. The guy I got it from
suggested as many people who feel they have something to say to young Alan,
should do so. Feel free to email yourself, and pass it to others of significance
ie. everyone (bombard the dumbo)

Tax motorcycles off roads

Author: Alan Mitchell Economics editor – mhmitchell@...


Date:01/12/2004

Words: 766

Publication: Australian Financial Review

Section: News

Page: 62




---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
  The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Go Phil !
yeah, my sentiments almost exactly!
Dear reader, please don't ever stay quiet ('pull your punches') when
your sense of rights and responsibilities (a sense very close to the
human heart) is offended by people such as Alan Mitchell of the Aust
Financial Review.
Why?
Remaining mute just encourages (and hands more power to) the bastards.
Tom Torok,
(in approx. order of priority:)
Lifeform (not corporate (machine) lackey),
Human being,
Human who wants a future,
new-humanist,
friend,
motorcyclist,
an MCCofNSW WebHamster.


phil wrote:

> Oh yes... what a beautiful opportunity to get so righteously upset about
> those wicked people who want to stop us from doing what we want...
>
> But hang on, isn't this just one bloke who writes for one newspaper and
> has but one opinion? I find there's nothing to be said about that,
> though it is sure fair enough to counter with opinions of our own.
>
> What irks me in is how often our elected bureaucrats limit our freedom
> and get away with it without as much as an embarrassed cough from Mr.
> General Public.
>
> I can't fathom how 'double demerits' on public holidays are so widely
> accepted, how we are spoon fed with 'speed kills' paranoia, how the
> g'ment overrules and overregulates every part of our lives and seemingly
> so easily gets away with it.
>
> C'mon guys, you really can't be surprised about this article! And if you
> are so upset by this purely hypothetical and (still) unrealistic piece,
> what about your other personal freedoms which have already been taken
> away from you?
>
> Time to wake up, Australia!
>
> Phil
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sydride-chat-bounces@...
> [mailto:Sydride-chat-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Guy
> Stanford
> Sent: Thursday, 2 December 2004 1:13 AM
> To: Sydride
> Subject: [Sydride-chat] [Sydride] Fin Review Article - Tax Motorcycles
> offthe road
>
> Financial Review has put their foot in it.
> Article full text below.
> <snip>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with subject "unsubscribe"
> to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *Yahoo! Groups Links*
>
>     * To visit your group on the web, go to:
>       http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/bikers_anon/
>
>     * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>       bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...
>       <mailto:bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...?subject=Unsubscribe>
>
>     * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
>       Service <http://au.docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Sydride-chat mailing list
>Sydride-chat@...
>http://cskk.ezoshosting.com/mailman/listinfo/sydride-chat_cskk.ezoshosting.com
>
>

Being a MOTORCYCLE FORUM I would suggest this would be the reason
for riders to be "righteously upset" wouldn't you think?
I have nothing for praise for those that do stand up, make some
noise and try to change things..
We will always guppies in the big pond, doesn't mean we can't splash
around and make one hell of a noise..
As for one writer at one newspaper? Does that mean he has only ONE
reader?? I don't think so..




--- In bikers_anon@..., "phil" <phil@c...> wrote:
> Oh yes... what a beautiful opportunity to get so righteously upset
about
> those wicked people who want to stop us from doing what we want...
>
> But hang on, isn't this just one bloke who writes for one
newspaper and
> has but one opinion? I find there's nothing to be said about that,
> though it is sure fair enough to counter with opinions of our own.
>
> What irks me in is how often our elected bureaucrats limit our
freedom
> and get away with it without as much as an embarrassed cough from
Mr.
> General Public.
>
> I can't fathom how 'double demerits' on public holidays are so
widely
> accepted, how we are spoon fed with 'speed kills' paranoia, how the
> g'ment overrules and overregulates every part of our lives and
seemingly
> so easily gets away with it.
>
> C'mon guys, you really can't be surprised about this article! And
if you
> are so upset by this purely hypothetical and (still) unrealistic
piece,
> what about your other personal freedoms which have already been
taken
> away from you?
>
> Time to wake up, Australia!
>
> Phil
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sydride-chat-bounces@c...
> [mailto:Sydride-chat-bounces@c...] On Behalf Of Guy
> Stanford
> Sent: Thursday, 2 December 2004 1:13 AM
> To: Sydride
> Subject: [Sydride-chat] [Sydride] Fin Review Article - Tax
Motorcycles
> offthe road
>
> Financial Review has put their foot in it.
> Article full text below.
> <snip>

Just read the letters from Simon Disney, Martin Cutler and John
Littler published in the AFR today, very impressive!

It was certainly decent of the AFR to publish not one but 3 examples
of unedited, contrary and disparaging return fire from our ranks.

The comic is humerous but sadly, it demonstrates a certain ineptness
other than what they choose to call us; the fact that motorcyclists
have always been united, something you figure out you are one.

I'd call it a win.... good onya guys and congrats!

Cheers and beers eh? !!

Hughsy
Vice Pres

--- In bikers_anon@..., "Uidam, T (Tim)" <tu-
nospam@r...> wrote:
> I've just checked out the "Letters" reposonses in today's AFR (page
71),
> we've managed three very astute letters to the editor. Well done to
> Simon, Martin & John, and also to the united effort of all other
riders
> for their responses.
>
> What made me laugh, though, was that we also managed to get one of
those
> political caricature comics (on the same page). Quite an effort!! :-
)
>
> Perhaps someone could scan it and upload it somewhere on the 'net?
> Anyway, the gist of the comic is two cops speaking to each other in
the
> office. One asks the other, "Someone's managed to unite the bike
gangs?
> Who?!". To which the second replies, "An Economist, Alan
mitchell...".
>
> *chuckle* "Bike gangs" ;-)
>
> Again, well done everyone :)
>
> Tim.
> _____________________________________________________________
>
> This email (including any attachments to it) is confidential,
legally privileged, subject to copyright and is sent for the personal
attention of the intended recipient only. If you have received this
email in error, please advise us immediately and delete it. You are
notified that disclosing, copying, distributing or taking any action
in reliance on the contents of this information is strictly
prohibited. Although we have taken reasonable precautions to ensure
no viruses are present in this email, we cannot accept responsibility
for any loss or damage arising from the viruses in this email or
attachments. We exclude any liability for the content of this email,
or for the consequences of any actions taken on the basis of the
information provided in this email or its attachments, unless that
information is subsequently confirmed in writing. If this email
contains an offer, that should be considered as an invitation to
treat.
> _____________________________________________________________

I've just checked out the "Letters" reposonses in today's AFR (page 71),
we've managed three very astute letters to the editor. Well done to
Simon, Martin & John, and also to the united effort of all other riders
for their responses.

What made me laugh, though, was that we also managed to get one of those
political caricature comics (on the same page). Quite an effort!! :-)

Perhaps someone could scan it and upload it somewhere on the 'net?
Anyway, the gist of the comic is two cops speaking to each other in the
office. One asks the other, "Someone's managed to unite the bike gangs?
Who?!". To which the second replies, "An Economist, Alan mitchell...".

*chuckle* "Bike gangs" ;-)

Again, well done everyone :)

Tim.
_____________________________________________________________

This email (including any attachments to it) is confidential, legally
privileged, subject to copyright and is sent for the personal attention of the
intended recipient only. If you have received this email in error, please advise
us immediately and delete it. You are notified that disclosing, copying,
distributing or taking any action in reliance on the contents of this
information is strictly prohibited. Although we have taken reasonable
precautions to ensure no viruses are present in this email, we cannot accept
responsibility for any loss or damage arising from the viruses in this email or
attachments. We exclude any liability for the content of this email, or for the
consequences of any actions taken on the basis of the information provided in
this email or its attachments, unless that information is subsequently confirmed
in writing. If this email contains an offer, that should be considered as an
invitation to treat.
_____________________________________________________________

Oh yes... what a beautiful opportunity to get so righteously upset about
those wicked people who want to stop us from doing what we want...

But hang on, isn't this just one bloke who writes for one newspaper and
has but one opinion? I find there's nothing to be said about that,
though it is sure fair enough to counter with opinions of our own.

What irks me in is how often our elected bureaucrats limit our freedom
and get away with it without as much as an embarrassed cough from Mr.
General Public.

I can't fathom how 'double demerits' on public holidays are so widely
accepted, how we are spoon fed with 'speed kills' paranoia, how the
g'ment overrules and overregulates every part of our lives and seemingly
so easily gets away with it.

C'mon guys, you really can't be surprised about this article! And if you
are so upset by this purely hypothetical and (still) unrealistic piece,
what about your other personal freedoms which have already been taken
away from you?

Time to wake up, Australia!

Phil

-----Original Message-----
From: Sydride-chat-bounces@...
[mailto:Sydride-chat-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Guy
Stanford
Sent: Thursday, 2 December 2004 1:13 AM
To: Sydride
Subject: [Sydride-chat] [Sydride] Fin Review Article - Tax Motorcycles
offthe road

Financial Review has put their foot in it.
Article full text below.
<snip>

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the bikers_anon
group.

   File        : /Bikers Anon Latest Event Calendar/BA Event Calendar Dec 04 Jan
05 V1.1.doc
   Uploaded by : hughsysmailbox <hughsysmailbox@...>
   Description : Dec 04 - Jan 05 BA Event Calendar

You can access this file at the URL

http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/bikers_anon/files/Bikers%20Anon%20Latest%20Even\
t%20Calendar/BA%20Event%20Calendar%20Dec%2004%20Jan%2005%20V1.1.doc

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit

http://help.yahoo.com/help/au/groups/files

Regards,

hughsysmailbox <hughsysmailbox@...>

The address for the Christmas Party is:

           Shop 5, 59-67 Strathallen Avenue, Northbridge

Time: 7pm + BYO

###########################################
Just a reminder that the BA Christmas party is on Saturday 4th
December (details below).

If you have not yet booked please get in contact ASAP

And for all those people have asked yes Billy is the guy who has
been appearing on the Channel 10 show Blokesworld (check your guides
I think it is on late Friday or Saturday night)

###########################################

Have you ever seen somebody stand on eggs while they smash a wine
bottle with their bare hands? NO, well why no come along to the BA
Christmas Party on Saturday 4th December and meet Sydney's own iron
chef Billy Mok.

Billy is just as well-known for his martial arts demonstrations as
he is for his culinary superiority and for just $30 he will be
providing us with a superb meal and amazing martial arts
demonstration. Check out photos at
http://www.oldhongkong.com.au/photo_album.html

Location: Shop 5, 59-67 Strathallen Avenue, Northbridge

Time: 7pm

If you have already put your name down and have not yet provided
me  with a deposit could you please get in contact ASAP to confirm
your  place.  If you are yet to book please send an e-mail to
ducati_lass@y...

Hi all

Just finished the Calendar, here's this Sunday's Ride details, will
post the Dec 04 - Jan 05 Calendar in full in the files section here
as soon as it's proof read by the rest of the committee.

Thanks Hughsy


DOC Cambewarra / Kangaroo Valley Ride Sunday 05/12/04

Come and join the Ducati Owners Club for this ride through some of
the most beautiful parts of the Southern Highlands. Meet at Cross
Roads Hotel at Casula at 9-00am for a 9-30 departure. Riding down
through the Southern Highlands, Cambewarra is 9kms out of Kangaroo
Valley and has a spectacular Lookout and mountain café for lunch.
Riding home via the Robinson Pie Shop for afternoon tea. Contact Cary
Peters 0412 049451 www.docnsw.org.au

Ride Rating  =  3 bikes

Your role in the Xmas party lol.
   ----- Original Message -----
   From: Manny
   To: bikers_anon@...
   Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 7:43 PM
   Subject: Re: [bikers_anon] Reminder - BA Christmas Part Saturday


   What's a Christmas part?
     ----- Original Message -----
     From: bikers_anon@...
     To: bikers_anon@...
     Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 7:03 PM
     Subject: [bikers_anon] Reminder - BA Christmas Part Saturday




     To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with subject "unsubscribe"
     to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...


          My Groups | bikers_anon Main Page


     We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

     BA Christmas Part Saturday

     Date: Saturday, December 4, 2004
     Time: 7:00PM EST (GMT+11:00)

     Come meet Sydney's Own iron chef! Billy is famous for not only
     his terrific food but also for his martial arts displays.
     $30 will get you all you can eat, places are strictly limited, 7
     pm start.
     Reserve you place on this not to be missed evening contact Robyn
     on ducati_lass@...







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   [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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   to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

What's a Christmas part?
   ----- Original Message -----
   From: bikers_anon@...
   To: bikers_anon@...
   Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 7:03 PM
   Subject: [bikers_anon] Reminder - BA Christmas Part Saturday




   To unsubscribe from this group, send an email with subject "unsubscribe"
   to: bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...


        My Groups | bikers_anon Main Page


   We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

   BA Christmas Part Saturday

   Date: Saturday, December 4, 2004
   Time: 7:00PM EST (GMT+11:00)

   Come meet Sydney's Own iron chef! Billy is famous for not only
   his terrific food but also for his martial arts displays.
   $30 will get you all you can eat, places are strictly limited, 7
   pm start.
   Reserve you place on this not to be missed evening contact Robyn
   on ducati_lass@...







------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   Yahoo! Groups Links

     a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
     http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/bikers_anon/

     b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
     bikers_anon-unsubscribe@...

     c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

BA Christmas Part Saturday

Date: Saturday, December 4, 2004
Time: 7:00PM EST (GMT+11:00)

Come meet Sydney's Own iron chef! Billy is famous for not only
his terrific food but also for his martial arts displays.
$30 will get you all you can eat, places are strictly limited, 7
pm start.
Reserve you place on this not to be missed evening contact Robyn
on ducati_lass@...

Hello everybody,

guess what, i have to work again on Sunday ( s h _ _  ).

But I want to go for an easy ride on Saturday the 4th December. If
anybody is interested to join, here are some Info for the start.

Meet          at the Shell Station on Epping Rd. Lane Cove
                   also  known as Spacestation I thing

When        9.30 for 10.00am take off ( sorry, want to sleep in )

Where to   up north for the start ( MT White ) , then either over
                    Wisemanns Ferry back home or we ride to the Central
                    Coast. That depends on the group and the weather

What to bring   a bike is not bad  ( just kidding )
                    You may bring your swimmer ( Central Coast !! )

I dont mind to cruise along, therefore beginners or bikers with
pillions are welcome.

So if you are interested just be there in time and everything else
will be easy.

One last thing: I dont know what kind of weather it will be, but if
its raining, i am the one who stays in bed, ok.

See you there
Andreas
( that german guy with the black ZZR )

-------- Original Message --------
Subject:  Re: [Sydride-chat] Re: Article titled "Tax Motorcycles off the
road"
Date:  Thu, 02 Dec 2004 11:03:30 +1100
From:  John Littler <johnlittler@...>
Reply-To:  Sydney and Surrounds Motorcycle Ride Discussion List
<Sydride-chat@...>
To:  Sydney and Surrounds Motorcycle Ride Discussion List
<Sydride-chat@...>
References:
<OF1B37913D.3CF800D5-ONCA256F5D.007E4E0A-CA256F5D.007E5EA9@...>



This is what I sent in:

> As an MBA student at the AGSM studying stats, I was appalled by Alan
> Mitchell's misuse of basic analytical principles, as an Economics
> undergrad, I was surprised an eminent economic commentator could so
> misunderstand the elasticities of demand and the shape of the utility
> curves in question. As a motorcyclist I was amused by the wildy
> inaccurate socio-economic stereotyping. There isn't a single
> assertion in the article which stands up to scrutiny in the context
> in which it was used, a level of journalism I would expect from the
> Daily Telegraph not the AFR.
>
> The vast majority of motorcycle users (excluding your local postie)
> do so as a recreation, not for commuting. Taxing inelastic goods has
> marginal impact on consumption, as we have found with cigarettes -
> anti smoking advertising campaigns and removal of smoking advertising
> had a far more significant impact on consumption than taxes did.
>
> 70% of urban motorcycle crashes are the legal fault of the other
> driver, blaming the victim is poor form and poor law.
>
> ===


Now I'm also committing a "don't publish" offence as well - questioning
the veracity and research of the journo (they hate it when you do that)


_______________________________________________
Sydride-chat mailing list
Sydride-chat@...
http://cskk.ezoshosting.com/mailman/listinfo/sydride-chat_cskk.ezoshosting.com

-------- Original Message --------
Subject:  [Mcc-delegates] AFR Article on Motorcycles
Date:  Thu, 2 Dec 2004 11:42:51 +1100
From:  David Rayner/650-XSories <davidjohnrayner@...>
To:  Guy Stanford <sstanfor@...>, MCC-Delegates
<MCC-delegates@...>
CC:  <edletters@...>, "TERRY GLIDDON" <toota@...>
References:  <NHBBIAHPMLDNGEAEGJPJKEEBDDAA.sstanfor@...>



Dear Sir,
             With regard to your recent piece on the removal of
motorcycles from Australian roads by way of making them too expensive
for anyone to afford - I wish to put forward the opposing argument.

It's already the case (at least in NSW) that a motorcycle over 300cc is
almost as expensive to own as a small car. I acknowledge that
motorcyclists are way over-represented in road crashes and yes, some are
the fault of the rider - usually travelling too fast. But most involve
the bike being hit by a car with the driver of the car often saying "I
didn't see him". A motorcycle is not invisible and this indicates that
many drivers pay only the minimum attention to the environment around
them. I've been hit by a car once and almost hit many times.

As your writer said, a bike uses less fuel, creates less pollution, and
takes up far less space on the road and in parking lots than a car. In
my opinion, they are reasons to promote the use of motorcycles by way of
making them far more financially attractive than a car. At one end of
the spectrum is the 4WD owner who never goes off road and sacrifices a
lot of money on buying and running a vehicle of that size, and puts up
with having to squeeze into a parking space for the sake of personal
safety. A case of "Mine's bigger than yours so if we collide, I
win". What if the rest of us bought 4WDs? Would these people buy trucks?
If everyone else bought trucks, would they then buy tanks? Where does it
end? Imagine the congestion on the roads at that point. At the other end
is the motorcycle rider who sacrifices personal safety for cheap
transport, never being caught in a traffic jam, and being always able to
find parking. Imagine walking along the footpath of George St, Sydney
with both arms held straight out to the sides. No one would do that and
you wouldn't get very far if you tried, but the owners of half the cars
on the road do this every day (figuratively speaking) proudly exclaiming
"I claim this much space on the road as my own when I really only need
1/4 of it".

The fact is that Sydney's roads are choked by cars with only one person
in them and you can't find parking anywhere. I'm not suggesting that
everyone sell their cars and buy motorcycles but many families have two
cars - why? They don't have two lots of kids to ferry around. If people
would replace their second car with a bike or buy a small bike in
addition to their only car, traffic jams would be far less of a problem.
Most people won't do that however, because it's too dangerous. And why
is that? Because of the car/bike ratio on the roads. If 30% of cars were
replaced with bikes, the drivers of the remaining 70% would suddenly see
bikes everywhere they looked and a bike would no longer be an unexpected
thing that came out of nowhere. Put another way - the more bikes and the
less cars there are on the road, the less motorcycle crashes there'd be.

I'll admit that I ride bikes because mainly for fun. The fuel economy,
ease of parking, and never being caught in a traffic jam are the icing
on the cake but the reverse can also apply. If a person with no previous
interest in bikes traded their second car for one for those reasons,
they might just find the fun of riding it is the icing on their cake.

A little over 100 years ago, personal transport was by horse alone, or
horse and cart. When the internal combustion engine was invented, the
horse and cart became a car and the horse alone became a motorcycle. I'd
like to propose a hypothetical scenario. Imagine today's world is the
way it is, except that the internal combustion engine had never been
invented. With over 100 years of development, the cart has evolved into
something like a modern Volvo with all the creature comforts and safety
equipment but with no engine - it must still be pulled by a horse (or
team of horses). The horse however, hasn't changed at all and falling
off one still hurts as much today as it did 100 years ago. Traffic on
today's roads is made up of 99% horses and carts and 1% horses. Now my
question - If you had to visit a friend a few suburbs away once in a
while, or travel from home to an outer suburban train station and then
by (steam) train into the city to work every day, and if it were just
you alone, if you didn't have to carry any luggage, and if it weren't
raining (even I drive my car on rainy days), would you assemble the
team, pull the cart out of the shed and hitch the team to it, drive off
to do battle on the roads that are choked with carts, pay for food and
water for six horses along the way, try to find a parking space big
enough for your team and cart, then do battle again on the way home, or
would you simply grab one horse and ride it?

Sincerely,
               David Rayner.

     ----- Original Message -----
     *From:* Guy Stanford <mailto:sstanfor@...>
     *To:* MCC-Delegates <mailto:MCC-delegates@...>
     *Cc:* Bapmug <mailto:bapmug@...> ; AMC-Delegates
     <mailto:AMC-delegates@...>
     *Sent:* Thursday, December 02, 2004 1:10 AM
     *Subject:* [Mcc-delegates] Fin Review Article

     Financial Review has put their foot in it.

     Read and spew.

     Refer to www.roadsafety.mccofnsw.org.au
     <http://www.roadsafety.mccofnsw.org.au> and look under "Safer
     People" for the real statistics.

     He decries risk - so where do we stop? With investors and financial
     risk too?
     The public purse argument won't wash  - what about youth suicide -
     one a day for heavens sake

     Maybe if he asked "WHY is motorcycling dangerous, he may discover
     that it receives virtually no funding and hasn't for 30 years.

     The first ever motorcycle safety programs run were from October
     2002, funded by your Greeenslip money from the MAA, who handed the
     money to RTA for implemeting - resulting in the Cow, the drinking
     helmet, the car mirror advert appearing on bus backs and more
     recently, the bus backs of "Blind Spotted" - this is NOT RTA money,
     but YOUR greenslip money coming back via MAA.

     That first advertising program followed the release in June 2002 of
     "Positioned for Safety" the motorcycle road safety Strategic Plan
     from the MCC of NSW. i.e. it is riders who are dealing with safety
     and government is starving us for funds and Alan Mitchell is blaming us.

     Removing motorcycles is the same lazy argument as banning young
     drivers - it avoids the problem instead of dealing with it.

     Direct your letters to

     edletters@...


     Please write, everyone. The more letters, the greater we can use
     this opportuinity to turn it to our advantage and pressure the
     government for more funding.

     This bloke is one of the most influential economics journos in the
     country, so we need to make a point loud and large by volume of
     letters and the paper will run with it.

     Respond to someone elses letter and keep the ball rolling for as
     long as we can

     Guy





     December 1^st , 2004
     Taken from The Financial Review

     In NSW, the Carr government is bravely trying to cut the road toll,
     even at the risk of alienating young motorists. However, its
     discussion paper has overlooked one simple measure that could result
     in a significant reduction in the road toll, including among young
     road users.

     NSW and the other states should tax motorcycles and motor scooters
     off the road.

     At the moment, the NSW road authorities encourage the use of
     motorcycles and scooters by allowing riders to use express and
     transit lanes.

     The authorities may be acting under the impression that bikes and
     scooters are a socially desirable form of transport: they use little
     petrol, cause no congestion, take up hardly any parking space, and
     generally make few demands on the environment.

     But of course that kind of calculus grossly understates the true
     cost imposed by motorcycle riders on the community.

     Statistics from studies in NSW and Victoria show that motorcycle
     riders and their pillion passengers are many times more likely to be
     killed or injured than other motorists.

     The risk of being killed or injured (per distance travelled) is 16
     to 18 times that of a car driver or passenger. If in an accident in
     Victoria, riders are 33 times more likely to be killed and 31 times
     more likely to suffer a serious injury.

     Motorcycle fatalities have declined dramatically in the past decade
     and a half as the use of motorcycles has declined. Motorcycles were
     aggressively marketed to young men and women in the 1970s and 1980s.
     But everyone, including governments, soon learned about their dangers.

     The number of people in NSW with motorcycle licences fell by about
     40per cent in the 1990s, possibly because of more stringent training
     and licensing requirements introduced in the mid 1980s. As a result,
     the number of fatalities was halved.

     Unfortunately, people forget, and motorcycles and motor scooters
     have come back into fashion, including among middle-aged men, who
     should know better.

     Nationally, registrations increased by almost 20 per cent in the
     five years to 2004. This compares with a 10 per cent increase in the
     number of passenger cars. The number of fatalities has also started
     to rise again.

     The big increase has been in the number of older riders. The
     proportion of motorcycles registered to people aged 40 or over is up
     by about 60 per cent.

     Older owners tend to ride bigger American and European bikes. And
     while they are much less likely than younger riders to have an
     accident, the number of crashes involving older drivers has been
     rising faster than the number of licence holders.

     In general, the severity of injuries suffered in motorcycle
     accidents tends to rise with the engine capacity of the motorcycle.
     The average size of third-party insurance claims for motorcycle
     accidents injuries is higher for riders and pillion passengers aged
     over 25.

     In the United States, the average total cost (including medical
     costs, lost earnings, lost quality of life) of motorcycle accidents
     is about 11 times that for motor vehicles as a whole. A similar
     ratio is likely in Australia.

     It is possible that people attracted to the speed and excitement of
     motorcycle riding will be accident prone in any form of transport.
     But their risks of serious injury, permanent disability and death
     would be lower in a car, and so would the cost to the community.

     A registration tax high enough to deter people from riding
     motorcycles will be opposed on the grounds of equity. Young riders
     are disproportionately low-paid or unemployed. Motorcycles are a
     "cheap" form of transport.

     For those young riders who live in the outer suburbs of the major
     cities, where public transport is poor, a bike may be essential to
     get to work or to look for a job.

     A heavy tax on motorcycles would be regressive, in the sense that it
     would fall more heavily on those with low incomes.

     However, like the heavy taxation of tobacco products, the equity
     consequences have to judged against their health outcomes.

     History has shown that governments can save people's lives simply by
     deterring them from getting on motorcycles. A compromise solution
     may be to phase in the higher tax, to give existing bike and scooter
     owners time to buy a car in the normal course of replacing their
     bikes. At least with lower tariffs and the rise of the Korean car
     industry, the choices for those looking for an alternative means of
     cheap transport have widened.

     Korean cars may be less exciting, but they last longer and, more
     importantly, so do both their drivers and their passengers.

http://tinypic.com/psvtg

Sponsors going with the bleeding obvious??



-------- Original Message --------
Subject:  [clubman-campfire] Max has a new sponser
Date:  Thu, 2 Dec 2004 16:17:55 +1100
From:  Michael <michael@...>
Reply-To:  clubman-campfire@yahoogroups.com
To:  Clubmancampfire <clubman-campfire@yahoogroups.com>




http://tinypic.com/psvtg



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Yahoo! Groups Links

Wheelie Teezn Summer Launch Party - WT2

Thursday 2nd December 2004 (TONIGHT!!)

@ OVEN Cafe & Espresso Bar
89 Paraween St. Cremorne
(behind the Hayden Orpheum Cinema)

6-9pm

Light refreshments served from 6pm.

Prizes and giveaways!!


=====
www.wheelieteezn.com.au

Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies.
http://au.movies.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

Circuit Breakers Ride day

Date: Thursday, December 16, 2004
Time: All Day

Ride Day Eastern Creek
$99.00 pre-paid

ahhh glad to see ur eastern states boys are on the ball!!
we got this in KSRC too, and weve already had several guys voice an
opinion...good works lads/lasses...wot a joke, i wont tell u wot i
thought of it, or wot KSRC thought of it as a whole, cos u probly
all feel the same!!
FOREVER TWO WHEELS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (gee that sounded cornier than i
expected)
neka

Hi Guys
Does anyone know the best way without damage or creating a mess -
how to clean the outer titanium skin on CBR954 stock exhaust can?
Its quite clean theres no grease on it just water spots from the
*last big wet*

cheers
mic

OMFG! Is it something in the water? I can't put a sensible email
together for this moron. I keep trailing into an assault of
accusations that will probably see me in jail.

It's a privilige for idiots to publish these "private studies" and
because one might be an "economics expert" their general knowledge
and 15 minutes of google searches constitute a thorough
investigation... and there are other idiots buying into it.

Luckily a chunk of over 40 Harley riders are doctors, lawyers and
probably the odd senior council who will do anything to ensure
their 'sunday hobby' is safe and secure.

Like Hughsy says, I expect there is not much momentum to this and
let's hope it fades into the background and takes this guys career
with it.

End dummy spit.


--- In bikers_anon@..., maxximcz@m... wrote:
>
> http://www.mcnews.com.au/NewsArchives/2004/dec_finreview.htm
>
> Nice one. Now where the hell did I put my passport? Time to go back
> to normal world. This country is getting mad. 130km limit on
speedos.
> Higher tax on motorcycles. Front numberplates. What's next?
>
> M.