harryproa : Messages : 2029-2058 of 6650

Rob,

I was just looking at a pic of whatever your boat is called - I guess it is THE Elementarry - anyway how about using the pole/tiller to shift/slide the rudder up the other end? I noticed a rope and pulley -that would take a litlle bit longer would it not?

If the rails are slippery enough.

Also how about a pin with a spring that you pull out to rlease the rudder, that is using a ropeto the helm station.

Are these anyhing you were thinking of improving.?

Also noticed you extended the rails out past the beams - I was calling past your house a week ago but you were not in.

Doug

Robert <cateran1949@...> wrote:

-5knot avrage with the windsurfer masts is nice cruising. Nice to
hear the the seahandling fits the theory
robert
-- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi Proa People,
>
>   Got to Mandurah, which is 50nm down the coast from Fremantle.
Nice ENE to head South with a low swell, and offshore winds was a
good run. Probably averaged above 5 knots most of the way. The
Easterly dropped away about 10am and I fell a sleep for an hour
waiting for the SWly seabreeze to come in. The breeze seemed a bit
more WSW so managed to stay on course for the Mandurah entrance which
is straight South. I got to the low wooden bridge in town and thought
about sailing under but chickened out and pullled the two winsurfer
masts out and rudder swished my way under and into Soldiers cove
withe the sails up agaain.
>
>   No new findings - speed very promising, goes through waves
without going up and downover them, comfortable enough on the deck,
rudder very light if raked forward slighty( though this stops the
rudder from being used as ascullibng oar, it needs to be angled
backwards), sheet controls work good, shunting is fun but at the
moment takes time to put the rudder up and then the other one down
and my sails aren't getting away fast enough to give the rudder
enough effect so makinng the shunting a bit of work expect this to
improve with the masts done.
>
>   Generally I expect the boat is more fun as you can look down at
the water under the beams and through the net, you can see all of the
rudder going through the water, and watch the entry and exit of
especially the LW hull. Getting on from wlking out in the water is
easy and the wide beam and high buoyancy hulls make a stable platform
for sailling and staying on board.
>
>   Doug
>
>
>
> Send instant messages to your online friends
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

#2057

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:34 am
Subject:: Re: Re: Continuing feedback on "SIDE CAR", Elementarry Camper

doha720

Offline

Yes Robert,

It is not readily comparable to other boats, the buoyancy and length of Elementarry hulls are noticeable compared to say a surf cat.

Multihull stability and deckspace contrasts against a mono hull, and draft, weight too.

I think when you get used to the new style of sailing with shunting instead of tackingand gybing, it comes very naturally and seems normal.

Doug

Robert <cateran1949@...> wrote:

-5knot avrage with the windsurfer masts is nice cruising. Nice to
hear the the seahandling fits the theory
robert
-- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi Proa People,
>
>   Got to Mandurah, which is 50nm down the coast from Fremantle.
Nice ENE to head South with a low swell, and offshore winds was a
good run. Probably averaged above 5 knots most of the way. The
Easterly dropped away about 10am and I fell a sleep for an hour
waiting for the SWly seabreeze to come in. The breeze seemed a bit
more WSW so managed to stay on course for the Mandurah entrance which
is straight South. I got to the low wooden bridge in town and thought
about sailing under but chickened out and pullled the two winsurfer
masts out and rudder swished my way under and into Soldiers cove
withe the sails up agaain.
>
>   No new findings - speed very promising, goes through waves
without going up and downover them, comfortable enough on the deck,
rudder very light if raked forward slighty( though this stops the
rudder from being used as ascullibng oar, it needs to be angled
backwards), sheet controls work good, shunting is fun but at the
moment takes time to put the rudder up and then the other one down
and my sails aren't getting away fast enough to give the rudder
enough effect so makinng the shunting a bit of work expect this to
improve with the masts done.
>
>   Generally I expect the boat is more fun as you can look down at
the water under the beams and through the net, you can see all of the
rudder going through the water, and watch the entry and exit of
especially the LW hull. Getting on from wlking out in the water is
easy and the wide beam and high buoyancy hulls make a stable platform
for sailling and staying on board.
>
>   Doug
>
>
>
> Send instant messages to your online friends
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

#2056

From: "Robert" <cateran1949@...>
Date: Fri Oct 13, 2006 1:21 am
Subject:: Re: Continuing feedback on "SIDE CAR", Elementarry Camper

cateran1949

Offline

-5knot avrage with the windsurfer masts is nice cruising. Nice to
hear the the seahandling fits the theory
  robert
-- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi Proa People,
>
>   Got to Mandurah, which is 50nm down the coast from Fremantle.
Nice ENE to head South with a low swell, and offshore winds was a
good run. Probably averaged above 5 knots most of the way. The
Easterly dropped away about 10am and I fell a sleep for an hour
waiting for the SWly seabreeze to come in. The breeze seemed a bit
more WSW so managed to stay on course for the Mandurah entrance which
is straight South. I got to the low wooden bridge in town and thought
about sailing under but chickened out and pullled the two winsurfer
masts out and rudder swished my way under and into Soldiers cove
withe the sails up agaain.
>
>   No new findings - speed very promising, goes through waves
without going up and downover them, comfortable enough on the deck,
rudder very light if raked forward slighty( though this stops the
rudder from being used as ascullibng oar, it needs to be angled
backwards), sheet controls work good, shunting is fun but at the
moment takes time to put the rudder up and then the other one down
and my sails aren't getting away fast enough to give the rudder
enough effect so makinng the shunting a bit of work expect this to
improve with the masts done.
>
>   Generally I expect the boat is more fun as you can look down at
the water under the beams and through the net, you can see all of the
rudder  going through the water, and watch the entry and exit of
especially the LW hull. Getting on from wlking out in the water is
easy and the wide beam and high buoyancy hulls make a stable platform
for sailling and staying on board.
>
>   Doug
>
>
>
>  Send instant messages to your online friends
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
>

#2055

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Wed Oct 11, 2006 12:02 pm
Subject:: Continuing feedback on "SIDE CAR", Elementarry Camper

doha720

Offline

Hi Proa People,

Got to Mandurah, which is 50nm down the coast from Fremantle. Nice ENE to head South with a low swell, and offshore winds was a good run. Probably averaged above 5 knots most of the way. The Easterly dropped away about 10am and I fell a sleep for an hour waiting for the SWly seabreeze to come in. The breeze seemed a bit more WSW so managed to stay on course for the Mandurah entrance which is straight South. I got to the low wooden bridge in town and thought about sailing under but chickened out and pullled the two winsurfer masts out and rudder swished my way under and into Soldiers cove withe the sails up agaain.

No new findings - speed very promising, goes through waves without going up and downover them, comfortable enough on the deck, rudder very light if raked forward slighty( though this stops the rudder from being used as ascullibng oar, it needs to be angled backwards), sheet controls work good, shunting is fun but at the moment takes time to put the rudder up and then the other one down and my sails aren't getting away fast enough to give the rudder enough effect so makinng the shunting a bit of work expect this to improve with the masts done.

Generally I expect the boat is more fun as you can look down at the water under the beams and through the net, you can see all of the rudder going through the water, and watch the entry and exit of especially the LW hull. Getting on from wlking out in the water is easy and the wide beam and high buoyancy hulls make a stable platform for sailling and staying on board.

Doug

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

#2054

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Mon Oct 2, 2006 9:54 am
Subject:: Re: Re: Camper Elementarry

doha720

Offline

Thanks Robert,

I don't know how you would go sitting on the deck, sailing with crocodiles passing underneath.

Robert <cateran1949@...> wrote:

Congratulations Doug,
Wait to see the cruising photos.--- In harryproa@...,
Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi Nicolas,
>
>   My name is Doug and maybe you can ask any questions about how
long, how hard , how expensive to build the Elementarry. I have
sailed it down the coast some way and have to recommend the
suitableness of this boat for cruising.
>   I still have to make the proper masts and try to send some photos
later.
>
>   Doug
>   Mandurah W.A.
>
> Nicolas Vivier <nvivier@i...> wrote:
>   Le Mercredi 20 Septembre 2006 04:18, Rob Denney a �crit :
> > The plans are ready, there is an amateur built one being launched
this
> > week.
>
> Was it launched finally ? I can't wait for photos !..
> --
> Nicolas Vivier
> Icarai
> tel : 02 33 41 38 91
> http://www.icarai.fr
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Now you can scan emails quickly with a reading pane. Get the new
Yahoo! Mail.
>

All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine

#2053

From: "Robert" <cateran1949@...>
Date: Mon Oct 2, 2006 7:46 am
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

cateran1949

Offline

Congratulations Doug,
  Wait to see the cruising photos.--- In harryproa@...,
Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi Nicolas,
>
>   My name is Doug and maybe you can ask any questions about how
long, how hard , how expensive to build the Elementarry. I have
sailed it down the coast some way and have to recommend the
suitableness of this boat for cruising.
>   I still have to make the proper masts and try to send some photos
later.
>
>   Doug
>   Mandurah W.A.
>
> Nicolas Vivier <nvivier@i...> wrote:
>   Le Mercredi 20 Septembre 2006 04:18, Rob Denney a �crit :
> > The plans are ready, there is an amateur built one being launched
this
> > week.
>
> Was it launched finally ? I can't wait for photos !..
> --
> Nicolas Vivier
> Icarai
> tel : 02 33 41 38 91
> http://www.icarai.fr
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>  Now you can scan emails quickly with a reading pane. Get the new
Yahoo! Mail.
>

#2052

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Sat Sep 30, 2006 1:16 am
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

doha720

Offline

Hi Nicolas,

My name is Doug and maybe you can ask any questions about how long, how hard , how expensive to build the Elementarry. I have sailed it down the coast some way and have to recommend the suitableness of this boat for cruising.

I still have to make the proper masts and try to send some photos later.

Doug

Mandurah W.A.

Nicolas Vivier <nvivier@...> wrote:

Le Mercredi 20 Septembre 2006 04:18, Rob Denney a �crit :
> The plans are ready, there is an amateur built one being launched this
> week.

Was it launched finally ? I can't wait for photos !..
--
Nicolas Vivier
Icarai
tel : 02 33 41 38 91
http://www.icarai.fr

Yahoo! Groups Links

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#2051

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Fri Sep 29, 2006 12:04 pm
Subject:: Re: Independent rudders

proaharry

Offline

G'day,

They can be advantageous when used together to steer the boat off a jetty it is being blown onto, and with a lot of care, to minimise leeway upwind. With our current rudder design, they have to turn in opposite directions while shunting as the hull is in the way.

If at all possible, though, they would be better if they were connected to a single wheel.

Regards,

Rob

----- Original Message -----

From: Herb Desson

To: harryproa@...

Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 3:06 PM

Subject: [harryproa] Independent rudders

What is the advantage of having independently controlled rudders
instead of rudders that work together with a single wheel or tiller?

It seems to me that independently controlled rudders would add to the
hassle materially and it is quite easy to have a single control by
simply flipping the control lines to one of them.

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/426 - Release Date: 8/23/2006

#2050

From: "Herb Desson" <squirebug@...>
Date: Fri Sep 29, 2006 7:06 am
Subject:: Independent rudders

squirebug

Offline

What is the advantage of having independently controlled rudders
instead of rudders that work together with a single wheel or tiller?

It seems to me that independently controlled rudders would add to the
hassle materially and it is quite easy to have a single control by
simply flipping the control lines to one of them.

#2049

From: Nicolas Vivier <nvivier@...>
Date: Wed Sep 27, 2006 1:43 pm
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

nico_bato

Offline

Le Mercredi 20 Septembre 2006 04:18, Rob Denney a �crit�:
>  The plans are ready, there is an amateur built one being launched this
> week.

Was it launched finally ? I can't wait for photos !..
--
Nicolas Vivier
Icarai
tel : 02 33 41 38 91
http://www.icarai.fr

#2048

From: "Robert" <cateran1949@...>
Date: Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:13 am
Subject:: Re: technology

cateran1949

Offline

-What a bummer, Commiserations on the effort of resurrection
  robert
-- In harryproa@..., "michele_balharry" <michele@o...>
wrote:
>
> Our internet service provider Veridas has sunk without trace, taking
> our website with them.  This is a considerable bother and will take
at
> least a few days to reactivate Harryproa.com
>
> Never fear - we shall return!
>
> Regards,
>
>    Michele
>

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (2)

#2047

From: "michele_balharry" <michele@...>
Date: Mon Sep 25, 2006 2:22 am
Subject:: technology

michele_balh...

Offline

Our internet service provider Veridas has sunk without trace, taking
our website with them.  This is a considerable bother and will take at
least a few days to reactivate Harryproa.com

Never fear - we shall return!

Regards,

    Michele

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (2)

#2046

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Wed Sep 20, 2006 4:25 pm
Subject:: Re: carbon tow

proaharry

Offline

G'day,

Tow is the individual bundles of fibres which make up the strands in woven
or uni cloth.  Known as gunstock to polyester people.  It is about half the
price per kg of uni, needs nothing to hold it together, goes around compound
curves without kinking and is not damaged by the weaving process.  It is the
form of carbon used for filament winding.

At present it is unobtainable, but if you pull the individual fibres from
uni or woven cloth (bit more difficult with knitted), then you can use this.

regards,

Rob


----- Original Message -----
From: "Nicolas Vivier" <nvivier@...>
To: <harryproa@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 11:05 PM
Subject: [harryproa] carbon tow


> Rob,
>
> You often mention "carbon tow". What do you mean ? Is it Carbon UD ? How
wide?
> Which weigt ?
>
> Regards
> --
> Nicolas Vivier
> Icarai
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/426 - Release Date: 8/23/2006
>

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (7)

#2045

From: Nicolas Vivier <nvivier@...>
Date: Wed Sep 20, 2006 3:05 pm
Subject:: carbon tow

nico_bato

Offline

Rob,

You often mention "carbon tow". What do you mean ? Is it Carbon UD ? How wide?
Which weigt ?

Regards
--
Nicolas Vivier
Icarai

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (7)

#2044

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:44 am
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

proaharry

Offline

> Rob Denney wrote:
> > G'day,
> > Pity about Harrigami, great about Elementarry!
> >
>
> Harrigami is delayed, not cancelled !

Excleelnt.
>
> Thank you for all those informations.
> How long is the wing mast ? I'm afraid it could be a problem for
> transport. How is built the tube ?

SIngle mast is 9m, schooner masts are 7.5m.  Anything less than 12m is no
problem to transport safely.  The tube is built in a pressure mould.  You
will need a compressor, but that is all.
>
> I have to think about the beams, telescopic or not. How are they
> attached to the hull on your boat ?

They are bonded to the boat with carbon tow, but uni glass would do.

> Do you have a design of "accomodations" in the camper version ?
> Finally do you have a rough material list and timetable for building ?

Accommodation is up to you.  Doug has put a floor in the windward hull and a
large hatch over it.   Looks pretty good.  There is room for one person to
sleep in the ww hull, or you could use the pop out tent on the web page, or
just erect a tent on the hard part of the trampoline.

regards,

Rob> Regards
> --
> Nicolas
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/426 - Release Date: 8/23/2006
>
>

#2043

From: Nicolas <nvivier@...>
Date: Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:09 am
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

nico_bato

Offline

Rob Denney wrote:
> G'day,
> Pity about Harrigami, great about Elementarry!
>

Harrigami is delayed, not cancelled !

Thank you for all those informations.
How long is the wing mast ? I'm afraid it could be a problem for
transport. How is built the tube ?

I have to think about the beams, telescopic or not. How are they
attached to the hull on your boat ?
Do you have a design of "accomodations" in the camper version ?
Finally do you have a rough material list and timetable for building ?

Regards
--
Nicolas

#2042

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Wed Sep 20, 2006 2:18 am
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

proaharry

Offline

Ooops, thought this was a private mail. The photos I attached are in the files and photos section of the group.

regards,

Rob

----- Original Message -----

From: Rob Denney

To: harryproa@...

Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 9:26 AM

Subject: Re: [harryproa] Camper Elementarry

G'day,
Pity about Harrigami, great about Elementarry!

The plans are ready, there is an amateur built one being launched this week.
The wing mast is a full length tube mast with a polystyrene/glass nose
piece, and sandwich sides glued on to bulkheads on the back. Not too
difficult, but as Youri has a mould, it is probably easier to get it from
him. Not as much fun, though.

The telescopic beams work well, although lacing up the tramp each time is a
bit of a nuisance. I have found it is easier to disassemble the beams on my
boat. But I have a nice soft beach to do this on. Without the beach,
telescoping is a better way.

My boat has one rudder, which works well, except at low speeds when turning
is a bit slow unless you shift your body weight as well. The actual design
of the tracks that the rudder moves on is not yet ready for release. Mine
work, but they are a bit complex and require the removal of the leeward half
of the trampoline (which completely solves the problem of lacing it on!).
My recommendation at this stage would be to use the two rudders mounted on
the hulls, and see how mine develops.

By the way, I have a source of some low cost carbon uni if you are
interested.

Attached are some pictures of my boat with only one mast. This works very
well. It also has one rudder, but this is not very visible. Check out the
photos on the yahoo harryproa chat group as well. Any questions, please
let me know.

Regards,

Rob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nicolas Vivier" <nvivier@...>
To: <harryproa@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 12:44 AM
Subject: [harryproa] Camper Elementarry

> Rob,
>
> I'm afraid I won't have enough time and money to finish building of my
> Harrygami in the next 2 years (and space in my boatyard also). Anyway I do
> have some money and few time. So I'm thinking about building first an
> Elementarry Camper.
> I've spoken with Youri from Wangka. I could buy him the leeward hull and
some
> parts.
> My question is :
> - Are the plans ready for this boat ?
> - How is built the wing mast ?
> - How are telescopic beams ?
> - Is there 1 or 2 rudders now ? Is the option validated at sea ?
> Do you have more pics or designs than on the website for this particular
> version ?
>
> Kind regards
> --
> Nicolas Vivier
> Icarai
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/426 - Release Date: 8/23/2006
>

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/426 - Release Date: 8/23/2006

#2041

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:26 am
Subject:: Re: Camper Elementarry

proaharry

Offline

G'day,
Pity about Harrigami, great about Elementarry!

The plans are ready, there is an amateur built one being launched this week.
The wing mast is a full length tube mast with a polystyrene/glass nose
piece, and sandwich sides glued on to bulkheads on the back.  Not too
difficult, but as Youri has a mould, it is probably easier to get it from
him.  Not as much fun, though.

The telescopic beams work well, although lacing up the tramp each time is a
bit of a nuisance.  I have found it is easier to disassemble the beams on my
boat.  But I have a nice soft beach to do this on.  Without the beach,
telescoping is a better way.

My boat has one rudder, which works well, except at low speeds when turning
is a bit slow unless you shift your body weight as well.  The actual design
of the tracks that the rudder moves on is not yet ready for release.  Mine
work, but they are a bit complex and require the removal of the leeward half
of the trampoline (which completely solves the problem of lacing it on!).
My recommendation at this stage would be to use the two rudders mounted on
the hulls, and see how mine develops.

By the way, I have a source of some low cost carbon uni if you are
interested.

Attached are some pictures of my boat with only one mast.  This works very
well.  It also has one rudder, but this is not very visible.  Check out the
photos on the yahoo harryproa chat group  as well.  Any questions, please
let me know.

Regards,

Rob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nicolas Vivier" <nvivier@...>
To: <harryproa@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 12:44 AM
Subject: [harryproa] Camper Elementarry


> Rob,
>
> I'm afraid I won't have enough time and money to finish building of my
> Harrygami in the next 2 years (and space in my boatyard also). Anyway I do
> have some money and few time. So I'm thinking about building first an
> Elementarry Camper.
> I've spoken with Youri from Wangka. I could buy him the leeward hull and
some
> parts.
> My question is :
> - Are the plans ready for this boat ?
> - How is built the wing mast ?
> - How are telescopic beams ?
> - Is there 1 or 2 rudders now ? Is the option validated at sea ?
> Do you have more pics or designs than on the website for this particular
> version ?
>
> Kind regards
> --
> Nicolas Vivier
> Icarai
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.11.5/426 - Release Date: 8/23/2006
>

#2040

From: Nicolas Vivier <nvivier@...>
Date: Tue Sep 19, 2006 4:44 pm
Subject:: Camper Elementarry

nico_bato

Offline

Rob,

I'm afraid I won't have enough time and money to finish building of my
Harrygami in the next 2 years (and space in my boatyard also). Anyway I do
have some money and few time. So I'm thinking about building first an
Elementarry Camper.
I've spoken with Youri from Wangka. I could buy him the leeward hull and some
parts.
My question is :
- Are the plans ready for this boat ?
- How is built the wing mast ?
- How are telescopic beams ?
- Is there 1 or 2 rudders now ? Is the option validated at sea ?
Do you have more pics or designs than on the website for this particular
version ?

Kind regards
--
Nicolas Vivier
Icarai

#2039

From: "Robert" <cateran1949@...>
Date: Mon Sep 18, 2006 4:20 am
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

cateran1949

Offline

--- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> I don't know what you're talking about, Robert.
>
>   Try restarting the Subject with something like - "Unstayed
mast ... ".
>
>   Doug
>
> Robert <cateran1949@y...> wrote:
>   I was looking at the problem for an unstayed mast and I thought
of
> having a ring that can be tightened- a bit like an oversisze hose
> clamp- that is pinned to the deck of the boat. This way you lift
the
> mast till it is just clear of the bearings, tighten the ring and
the
> base is secured while you lay the mast down.
> I was looking at making the ring out of PVC pipe, cut, with  the
> ends of the cut heated and bent to take the cam lock pin. Tie a
> couple of strings to the mast as temporary stays to keep it under
> control
> regards,
> robert
> --- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...>
wrote:
> >
> > hI rOB,
> >
> >   Yeah I'd like some to make the wing masts Elementarry. Probably
> limit the quantity to a price limit say$200 that might make a fair
> bit of the masts. I think I might try foam sandwich - the main
thing
> for me is unshipping the masts o get under Mandurah, Canning,
> Causeway bridges, mostly Mandurah as I have a home here. Otherwise
I
> would not bother about carbon and foam, as the boat is getting
pretty
> heavy and more stable for cruising all the time. I don't think it
is
> to easy to lift out a glass/kiri mast plus boom, while standing I
> gueass on the beam and LW hull, so it might just be better to avoid
> any bridge under 6m.
> >   Comparing the elementarry masts to the aluminium 6oddm mast on
> the Hartley16' and it is lifted up vertically off a pin and then
> layed out along the cabintop, and is a pretty slim section but
would
> the carbon mast evenn be as light as that, what with the boom and
> this wing shape I got sent from Myriam and Youri?
> >   The whole boat is quite heavy such as the beams and platform
are
> now joined to the lw hull and lifting the beams up and over to get
at
> the under side is quite an effort. The effect of a lighter mast is
> not going to effect the sailing speeds much will it?
> >
> >   Rain on Monday maybe too.
> >   When was Carbon expected to arrive anyway, cause I'll start the
> masts in about 2 weeks.
> >
> >   Doug
> >
> >   I've made every thing else already and it is all OK with glass.
> >
> >
> >
> > Rob Denney <proa@i...> wrote:
> >           G'day,
> >
> >   I have been offered some surplus to requirements standard
modulus
> carbon uni.
> >
> >   300 gsm (9 ounce) 1.22m/48" wide is $AUS75/kg, $AUS22.50 per sq
m
> which is near enough $US25.60/pound, $US1.57 per sq'.
> >
> >   200 gsm (6 ounce) and 150 gsm (4 ounce) are 5 and 10% dearer.
> >
> >   Less than a roll, add 20%.  Local duties and taxes will be
> extra.
> >
> >   10% off these prices for Harryproa list members.
> >
> >   No idea how these prices compare in the USA or elsewhere, but
> they are about half what we pay in Australia, when it is available,
> which at present it is not.
> >
> >   Anyone interested, please let me know.   I have to place an
order
> very soon or miss out.
> >
> >   regards,
> >
> >   Rob
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> >  All New Yahoo! Mail � Tired of Vi@gr@! come-ons? Let our
SpamGuard
> protect you.
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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>

#2038

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Sat Sep 16, 2006 9:36 am
Subject:: Re: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

doha720

Offline

I don't know what you're talking about, Robert.

Try restarting the Subject with something like - "Unstayed mast ... ".

Doug

Robert <cateran1949@...> wrote:

I was looking at the problem for an unstayed mast and I thought of
having a ring that can be tightened- a bit like an oversisze hose
clamp- that is pinned to the deck of the boat. This way you lift the
mast till it is just clear of the bearings, tighten the ring and the
base is secured while you lay the mast down.
I was looking at making the ring out of PVC pipe, cut, with the
ends of the cut heated and bent to take the cam lock pin. Tie a
couple of strings to the mast as temporary stays to keep it under
control
regards,
robert
--- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> hI rOB,
>
>   Yeah I'd like some to make the wing masts Elementarry. Probably
limit the quantity to a price limit say$200 that might make a fair
bit of the masts. I think I might try foam sandwich - the main thing
for me is unshipping the masts o get under Mandurah, Canning,
Causeway bridges, mostly Mandurah as I have a home here. Otherwise I
would not bother about carbon and foam, as the boat is getting pretty
heavy and more stable for cruising all the time. I don't think it is
to easy to lift out a glass/kiri mast plus boom, while standing I
gueass on the beam and LW hull, so it might just be better to avoid
any bridge under 6m.
>   Comparing the elementarry masts to the aluminium 6oddm mast on
the Hartley16' and it is lifted up vertically off a pin and then
layed out along the cabintop, and is a pretty slim section but would
the carbon mast evenn be as light as that, what with the boom and
this wing shape I got sent from Myriam and Youri?
>   The whole boat is quite heavy such as the beams and platform are
now joined to the lw hull and lifting the beams up and over to get at
the under side is quite an effort. The effect of a lighter mast is
not going to effect the sailing speeds much will it?
>
>   Rain on Monday maybe too.
>   When was Carbon expected to arrive anyway, cause I'll start the
masts in about 2 weeks.
>
>   Doug
>
>   I've made every thing else already and it is all OK with glass.
>
>
>
> Rob Denney <proa@i...> wrote:
>           G'day,
>
>   I have been offered some surplus to requirements standard modulus
carbon uni.
>
>   300 gsm (9 ounce) 1.22m/48" wide is $AUS75/kg, $AUS22.50 per sq m
which is near enough $US25.60/pound, $US1.57 per sq'.
>
>   200 gsm (6 ounce) and 150 gsm (4 ounce) are 5 and 10% dearer.
>
>   Less than a roll, add 20%. Local duties and taxes will be
extra.
>
>   10% off these prices for Harryproa list members.
>
>   No idea how these prices compare in the USA or elsewhere, but
they are about half what we pay in Australia, when it is available,
which at present it is not.
>
>   Anyone interested, please let me know.   I have to place an order
very soon or miss out.
>
>   regards,
>
>   Rob
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> All New Yahoo! Mail � Tired of Vi@gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard
protect you.
>

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#2037

From: "Robert" <cateran1949@...>
Date: Mon Sep 11, 2006 11:41 pm
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

cateran1949

Offline

I was looking at the problem for an unstayed mast and I thought of
having a ring that can be tightened- a bit like an oversisze hose
clamp- that is pinned to the deck of the boat. This way you lift the
mast till it is just clear of the bearings, tighten the ring and the
base is secured while you lay the mast down.
  I was looking at making the ring out of PVC pipe, cut, with  the
ends of the cut heated and bent to take the cam lock pin. Tie a
couple of strings to the mast as temporary stays to keep it under
control
regards,
  robert
--- In harryproa@..., Doug Haines <doha720@y...> wrote:
>
> hI rOB,
>
>   Yeah I'd like some to make the wing masts Elementarry. Probably
limit the quantity to a price limit say$200 that might make a fair
bit of the masts. I think I might try foam sandwich - the main thing
for me is unshipping the masts o get under Mandurah, Canning,
Causeway bridges, mostly Mandurah as I have a home here. Otherwise I
would not bother about carbon and foam, as the boat is getting pretty
heavy and more stable for cruising all the time. I don't think it is
to easy to lift out a glass/kiri mast plus boom, while standing I
gueass on the beam and LW hull, so it might just be better to avoid
any bridge under 6m.
>   Comparing the elementarry masts to the aluminium 6oddm mast on
the Hartley16' and it is lifted up vertically off a pin and then
layed out along the cabintop, and is a pretty slim section but would
the carbon mast evenn be as light as that, what with the boom and
this wing shape I got sent from Myriam and Youri?
>   The whole boat is quite heavy such as the beams and platform are
now joined to the lw hull and lifting the beams up and over to get at
the under side is quite an effort. The effect of a lighter mast is
not going to effect the sailing speeds much will it?
>
>   Rain on Monday maybe too.
>   When was Carbon expected to arrive anyway, cause I'll start the
masts in about 2 weeks.
>
>   Doug
>
>   I've made every thing else already and it is all OK with glass.
>
>
>
> Rob Denney <proa@i...> wrote:
>           G'day,
>
>   I have been offered some surplus to requirements standard modulus
carbon uni.
>
>   300 gsm (9 ounce) 1.22m/48" wide is $AUS75/kg, $AUS22.50 per sq m
which is near enough $US25.60/pound, $US1.57 per sq'.
>
>   200 gsm (6 ounce) and 150 gsm (4 ounce) are 5 and 10% dearer.
>
>   Less than a roll, add 20%.  Local duties and taxes will be
extra.
>
>   10% off these prices for Harryproa list members.
>
>   No idea how these prices compare in the USA or elsewhere, but
they are about half what we pay in Australia, when it is available,
which at present it is not.
>
>   Anyone interested, please let me know.   I have to place an order
very soon or miss out.
>
>   regards,
>
>   Rob
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>  All New Yahoo! Mail � Tired of Vi@gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard
protect you.
>

#2036

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Thu Sep 7, 2006 2:31 am
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

proaharry

Offline

hI rOB,

Yeah I'd like some to make the wing masts Elementarry. Probably limit the quantity to a price limit say$200 that might make a fair bit of the masts. I think I might try foam sandwich - the main thing for me is unshipping the masts o get under Mandurah, Canning, Causeway bridges, mostly Mandurah as I have a home here. Otherwise I would not bother about carbon and foam, as the boat is getting pretty heavy and more stable for cruising all the time. I don't think it is to easy to lift out a glass/kiri mast plus boom, while standing I gueass on the beam and LW hull, so it might just be better to avoid any bridge under 6m.

Lifting out an unstayed mast under way will be difficult, and if you slip, you tear a chunk out of the boat. Using a gin pole is easier, but I'd still only do it in calm seas.

Comparing the elementarry masts to the aluminium 6oddm mast on the Hartley16' and it is lifted up vertically off a pin and then layed out along the cabintop, and is a pretty slim section but would the carbon mast evenn be as light as that, what with the boom and this wing shape I got sent from Myriam and Youri?

Probably heavier, but the cumbersomeness is more of an issue than the weight.

The whole boat is quite heavy such as the beams and platform are now joined to the lw hull and lifting the beams up and over to get at the under side is quite an effort. The effect of a lighter mast is not going to effect the sailing speeds much will it?

Not the speed, but it will increase the pitching (not much) and reduce the angle at which you reach point of no return in a capsize (but not by much) Will also make it harder to right, but as a cruiser, you should never come close to capsize so not a problem.

Rain on Monday maybe too.

When was Carbon expected to arrive anyway, cause I'll start the masts in about 2 weeks.

Bummer, carbon won't be here for at least 6 weeks.

regards,

Rob

Doug

I've made every thing else already and it is all OK with glass.

Rob Denney <proa@...> wrote:

G'day,

I have been offered some surplus to requirements standard modulus carbon uni.

300 gsm (9 ounce) 1.22m/48" wide is $AUS75/kg, $AUS22.50 per sq m which is near enough $US25.60/pound, $US1.57 per sq'.

200 gsm (6 ounce) and 150 gsm (4 ounce) are 5 and 10% dearer.

Less than a roll, add 20%. Local duties and taxes will be extra.

10% off these prices for Harryproa list members.

No idea how these prices compare in the USA or elsewhere, but they are about half what we pay in Australia, when it is available, which at present it is not.

Anyone interested, please let me know.   I have to place an order very soon or miss out.

regards,

Rob

All New Yahoo! Mail � Tired of Vi@gr@! come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you.

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#2035

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Thu Sep 7, 2006 2:10 am
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

doha720

Offline

hI rOB,

Yeah I'd like some to make the wing masts Elementarry. Probably limit the quantity to a price limit say$200 that might make a fair bit of the masts. I think I might try foam sandwich - the main thing for me is unshipping the masts o get under Mandurah, Canning, Causeway bridges, mostly Mandurah as I have a home here. Otherwise I would not bother about carbon and foam, as the boat is getting pretty heavy and more stable for cruising all the time. I don't think it is to easy to lift out a glass/kiri mast plus boom, while standing I gueass on the beam and LW hull, so it might just be better to avoid any bridge under 6m.

Comparing the elementarry masts to the aluminium 6oddm mast on the Hartley16' and it is lifted up vertically off a pin and then layed out along the cabintop, and is a pretty slim section but would the carbon mast evenn be as light as that, what with the boom and this wing shape I got sent from Myriam and Youri?

The whole boat is quite heavy such as the beams and platform are now joined to the lw hull and lifting the beams up and over to get at the under side is quite an effort. The effect of a lighter mast is not going to effect the sailing speeds much will it?

Rain on Monday maybe too.

When was Carbon expected to arrive anyway, cause I'll start the masts in about 2 weeks.

Doug

I've made every thing else already and it is all OK with glass.

Rob Denney <proa@...> wrote:

G'day,

I have been offered some surplus to requirements standard modulus carbon uni.

300 gsm (9 ounce) 1.22m/48" wide is $AUS75/kg, $AUS22.50 per sq m which is near enough $US25.60/pound, $US1.57 per sq'.

200 gsm (6 ounce) and 150 gsm (4 ounce) are 5 and 10% dearer.

Less than a roll, add 20%. Local duties and taxes will be extra.

10% off these prices for Harryproa list members.

No idea how these prices compare in the USA or elsewhere, but they are about half what we pay in Australia, when it is available, which at present it is not.

Anyone interested, please let me know.   I have to place an order very soon or miss out.

regards,

Rob

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#2034

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Wed Sep 6, 2006 2:14 pm
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

proaharry

Offline

G'day,

I have been offered some surplus to requirements standard modulus carbon uni.

300 gsm (9 ounce) 1.22m/48" wide is $AUS75/kg, $AUS22.50 per sq m which is near enough $US25.60/pound, $US1.57 per sq'.

200 gsm (6 ounce) and 150 gsm (4 ounce) are 5 and 10% dearer.

Less than a roll, add 20%. Local duties and taxes will be extra.

10% off these prices for Harryproa list members.

No idea how these prices compare in the USA or elsewhere, but they are about half what we pay in Australia, when it is available, which at present it is not.

Anyone interested, please let me know. I have to place an order very soon or miss out.

regards,

Rob

#2033

From: "yaendenboom" <wangka@...>
Date: Tue Sep 5, 2006 2:36 pm
Subject:: site update

yaendenboom

Offline

Dear people,

Our site has been updated.
We kindly invite you to have a look at:
     www.wangkaboats.eu

Suggestions and criticism is welcome at:
     info@...

Thank you very much,

Myriam & Youri
Wangka bvba
Belgium

Reply | Forward | Messages in this Topic (40)

#2032

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Mon Sep 4, 2006 10:38 am
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

doha720

Offline

I'll be at Maylands from Tuesday 10am 'till Thursday starts to rain.

I'l come to your place sometime maybe Thursday.

Doug
Rob Denney <proa@...> wrote:

G'day,

Any time you like between 9.30 and 2.30 except Wednesdays and weekends, unless you can't make it weekdays. Give me a ring first. I won't be sailing for at least a couple of weeks, need to finish off the rudder. Bring the sails, but not sure what I will be able to tell you about them.

Presume you were rained off on Friday, what days and times will you be there this week?

----- Original Message -----

From: Doug Haines

To: harryproa@...

Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 1:15 PM

Subject: [harryproa] Like to look at your Elementarry

Rob,

I'd like to check out the bits and pieces gear placement and talk about thwe mast/sails with you. a sail would be really good. Before I start making the mast. I've got 2 sails and could bring one along to see what you think.

Doug Haines

Mandurah and Maylands Boat Yard.

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#2031

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Mon Sep 4, 2006 5:42 am
Subject:: Re: Like to look at your Elementarry

proaharry

Offline

G'day,

Any time you like between 9.30 and 2.30 except Wednesdays and weekends, unless you can't make it weekdays. Give me a ring first. I won't be sailing for at least a couple of weeks, need to finish off the rudder. Bring the sails, but not sure what I will be able to tell you about them.

Presume you were rained off on Friday, what days and times will you be there this week?

----- Original Message -----

From: Doug Haines

To: harryproa@...

Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 1:15 PM

Subject: [harryproa] Like to look at your Elementarry

Rob,

I'd like to check out the bits and pieces gear placement and talk about thwe mast/sails with you. a sail would be really good. Before I start making the mast. I've got 2 sails and could bring one along to see what you think.

Doug Haines

Mandurah and Maylands Boat Yard.

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#2030

From: Doug Haines <doha720@...>
Date: Mon Sep 4, 2006 5:15 am
Subject:: Like to look at your Elementarry

doha720

Offline

Rob,

I'd like to check out the bits and pieces gear placement and talk about thwe mast/sails with you. a sail would be really good. Before I start making the mast. I've got 2 sails and could bring one along to see what you think.

Doug Haines

Mandurah and Maylands Boat Yard.

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#2029

From: "Rob Denney" <proa@...>
Date: Sat Sep 2, 2006 2:12 pm
Subject:: Re: Harrigami top and cruising speed

proaharry

Offline

G'day,

Flat water, minimal load, should be able to cruise at 15, top speed maybe 20.

regards,

Rob

----- Original Message -----

From: Nicolas Vivier

To: harryproa@...

Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 3:46 PM

Subject: [harryproa] Harrigami top and cruising speed

Rob,

Could you tell us what you think would be the cruising and top speeds for an
Harrigami ?

Regards
--
Nicolas Vivier
Icarai

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